In later starts, expanding north becomes increasingly difficult and by 1066, many rulers of the area have converted to Islam. Agnatic, stability are very safe options, but with the ship tech boost i always manage to kidnap one of "Niall of the 9 hostages" bloodline carrier, then incorporate tanistry after 2 gens into my empire. Hellenic paganism was the faith of the Greco-Roman world before the rise of Christianity. However, all the random events based on traits (which drop relations by 15 for those without and raise by 15 for those with the trait) are the same, along with the end bonus of 100 piety and prestige and +15 to vassal relations for one year. They start as feudal, are unable to raid, have lesser chance to convert county religion, do not suffer from increased short reign penalties and may use ultimogeniture succession law instead of gavelkind. No female temple holders. The African faith is followed by the peoples of sub-Saharan Africa. Penalties Pagan vassals are more likely to seek independence, and gain warscore more rapidly than others in independence wars. The Short Reign penalty is reduced to merely double the normal amount for Germanic pagans among the same Germanic faith, but Old Germanic pagans will have the full -45 penalty in addition to the heretic penalty. Hinduism is solid with the early Holy Order, morale buff, patron deities and raiding but they lack any inheritance/realm management perks. Youre all but guaranteed the successor you want, and unlike Open succession you dont have to worry about your AI heir doing stupid things when you land them. 100% objectively correct scientific analysis of the civilized/barbaric nature of every religion and heresy's gameplay features in CK2. I like this feature but it's tough to convert others outside your realm. It also supports early-game dominance - you are next-to-none as a Germanic ruler in 867. Ancestor Worship decision available. Kiev in 769 is notably a start whose default ruler, Dobrava Turov, is a woman. Autonomous leadership also enables four branches: With the new reformation system, some synergies occur which present new abilities or opportunities to characters of this specific reformed religion. There are 6 Natures you can choose from, all with their advantages and disadvantages: Peaceful Bonuses +3 Demesne limit. It's hard for me to rate a largely RNG mechanic highly. I'm still mad how badly Shia got shafted over the development of the game. Nature: Peaceful ( you will rule a massive empire as a Roman and will mostly have Vassal Kings. Crusader Kings 2 ; Best Pagan mods for CK2 Best Pagan mods for CK2. These three are weird. I would say go with the form of paganism you like best. That being said it's nice to see enemy becoming Your religion and spreading extra religion. The pagan homeland attrition penalty does not function, however, against other unreformed pagans. No females in the council. With bad technology. This severely slows down early-game conquest of the typically smaller, fractious pagan realms by expanding Abrahamics. Seabound is just useless without Daring and picking these two doctrines is silly (unless we are not getting bored with constant raiding on our foes). Rulers with Zunist holy sites in their demesne may also secretly convert to the faith. Answered, CK2 (Crusader Kings II): Immortality Event ID and Guide, CK2 (Crusader Kings II): Strange Chest Item and Event Results. Can't agree with stability doctrine, tech and artifacts lower short reign penalty so it is not worth to take it, and as I said from my experience it is easy to overcome. if you raid a lot + capture bonus from society + capture bonus from the military trait. All Offensive pagans also gain a +30% bonus to their levy sizes, making up for likely lower technology and smaller fort holdings. Stuff that sounds good at first sometimes turns out to be not so great. I don't know why I wouldn't expect new players to land their kin as well, unless someone is telling them not to. Reforming a pagan faith establishes a formal religious hierarchy and scripture - adapting elements of the Abrahamic faiths in order to more effectively oppose them. All defensive pagans have access to Ancestor Worship & Choose Patron deity decision. Matrilineal marriages are disabled. Access to Hermetic society. Note that reformed pagans may not send missionaries, the only organized religion group with this distinction. "Converting" for a day so you can join a society seems pretty gamey to me - i.e. You must log in or register to reply here. - can ask the leader of this realm to help convert the tribal leader's realm to the organized religion.Benefactor needs to be non-tribal, non-nomadic, non-theocracy (so you can't ask Pope for mass conversion . It says we can spend piety to improve curtier abilities but we can do it once per 5 years and can improve stat for one point. However, the longer the faith goes unreformed, the weaker it becomes. +5% Morale of armies. Thats all for now! Depends on what you want. No females in the council. It has a synergy with incest doctrine making us high god of our religion. Invaders are only here because they have 3 shitty doctrines that are good when they are packed in one slot. Women can take up to 3 consorts. Reforming the religion removes these restrictions, allowing tribal rulers to use gavelkind and allowing feudal rulers to use primogeniture. Patron Deities, Ancestor Worship. Acquiring the faith to begin with requires you to convert religions or use Ruler Designer, and its holy sites are split up between the Italia, Britannia, Spain, Francia, and Maghreb. Peacefull is OK, but greatly reduces your ability to expand. Holy sites: Perm, Ryazan, Novgorod (shared with Slavic), Saaremaa, and Kexholm. I usually take unyielding but in the future I think I'll go with Proselytizing. You must log in or register to reply here. Rulers do not receive opinion penalties for raised vassal levies. It's aimed at more of the casual/intermediate player. Agnatic law is enforced, open succession law is unlocked. Germanic pagans do not have to reform to create the Jomsvikings; instead, they must control Stettin, Wolgast, Rgen or Werle.). Romuva does not disappear from the world at any starting date, but will eventually be pushed back by Christians. He is a culturally Norse Germanic pagan but has a Slavic son. Disallow avuncular marriage and cousin marriage. This discussion is purely about game mechanics. Stability is in fact quite helpful and has nice synergies, but I wouldn't pick it standalone. The gavelkind succession law will remain even if you return to an unreformed pagan religion later. Expect frequent raids and wars between realms that accept the new faith and those that reject it. The only cb you'll ever need is alexanders invasion. Enatic Clans doctrine is extra powerful because one can easily 'breed in' several bloodlines by simply doing matrilineal marriages over a few generations. With A Crown Of Thorns, You Became My King Forever. With , reformers can decide doctrines for the reformed faith. Finding one of the few Hellenic characters, and having them educate your child or granting them a title: This page was last edited on 16 August 2022, at 07:19. Yea i know all that, and i never said i liked it. Btw, is there any reason NOT to take unyelding? but i'm talking about game mechanics here, compared to Catholicism, Orthodoxy in-game has nothing unique really, hell, it didn't even have it's own Holy Order till recently. Thread starter AwesomeKeith; Start date Mar 26, 2016; Jump to latest Follow Reply . When you login first time using a Social Login button, we collect your account public profile information shared by Social Login provider, based on your privacy settings. Ruler does not receive opinion penalties for raised vassal levies. If you want internal stability, pick Hierocratic and enjoy your excommunications. Levy size bonus from unreformed Aztec faith will be lost. Reformation tends to grant benefits of stability and the capacity to declare wars on larger-scale targets that smaller pagan nations couldn't attack, but lose many of the benefits that would help a small pagan nation expand more readily or defend itself from larger targets. Raiding unavailable if culture doesnt allow raiding. Meritocracy is just delayed open succession after we get to Primogeniture law. Inversely, it is much easier for organized religions to convert pagans. If gender flexibility is desired, Ancestor Veneration can be chosen for Eldership succession. Unlocks Raiding if unavailable (eg Hellenic). The resulting empty holding slots further strengthens the horde. My guide was more aimed at the casual/experienced player rather than the hardcore veteran (hardcore veterans don't need guides/tierlists!). Tax on subjects of different religious group is allowed. I have received few private messages and some even answered to the thread when the post was very old. The best Doctrines by far are the two "Clans" option with the slight edge to Enatic. The homeland attrition penalty does apply to reformed pagans of another faith, but the "old faith" heresies have no such protection against the reformed churches of their specific branch of paganism. However, stability is very low, and you have little control over your realm. If you have tribal government, it is recommended to choose either Agnatic Clans or Enatic Clans doctrine to avoid Gavelkind succession law. Knowing that Civilized is the best "peaceful" doctrine, pair that with stability, temporal so you decide your own holy wars and get a permanent artifact and set it to proselytize so that every follower of your religious works to eliminate religious bordergore. Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. Eldership Succession law is available, Bloodthirsty Gods + Seabound + Unrelenting, Rulers do not receive opinion penalties for raised vassal levies + Syncretism + Meritocracy. Keeping moral authority high is also a problem due to weak realms who often lose religious wars. Germanic faith is the faith of Scandinavian & Saxon people, worshiping deities like Odin/Wotan. Prisoners of different religions can be sacrificed for Piety. Even as Catholic I would land my kin (I tried to do that as Muslim and learned the hard way via decadence revolts to never do it again). Rulers can order subject to Take the Vows. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. The faith is in a strong position in the 769 start as north Africa is mainly ruled by tiny Muslim realms which can easily be conquered after consolidating your position in the south. It has synergy with Agnatic and Enatic doctries, giving us new CB for Patriarchal and Matriarchal depositions. Raiding culture allows the use of armies to raid while fabricating claims, and still get piety for remaining at peace. Intermarry Eastern group, Zoroastrian group. Foreign rulers will sometimes send missionaries. By doing a Pagan Reformation, the player decides to change the way their religion works for their CK2 playthrough. Unyielding: This would be my number one if I had to chose. C. Civilized/Religious Tax: The best Doctrine you can possibly pick. If consorts are available and the Peaceful religion nature and Tribalist traits from Autonomous leadership outweigh the Short Reign penalty (and the player ensures that most vassals are of the player's dynasty), it makes sense to pick Divine Marriage instead of Stability, to get an even higher score from Divine marriages, in situations where inbreeding is already likely. If there is levy size & attack bonus from unreformed religion or morale bonus from Animistic doctrine in first doctrine slot, it is lost. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. [1] These are not immediately obvious before reformation, or even immediately upon reformation. Pagan non-nomads normally requires the Old Gods or Holy Fury DLC to be playable. Another approach is to try new mechanics (to pick Haruspicy, Animism, Veneration) or to add useful abilities to existing faiths (e.g. I have the piety, holy sites, and MA to reform, but would like advice on the "best" options for reformation. I think the only time I mention something similar is switching to Germanic to use Prepared Invasion in the context of Daring. Animistic has same problems as unrelenting, it gives rite of passage event when reaching adulthood which has some flavour. +15 vassal opinion. Marry 4 women with good traits, then pick the best kid that pops out. Autonomous leadership bonus for an attribute depends on original pagan religion. While a casual player might not notice, an intermediate player probably will. All trademarks are property of their respective owners in the US and other countries. Equality can be achieved with enough tech by the year 950+ . Also, your heir will very often be past childbearing age by the time they take the throne which, combined with the fertility debuff for unlanded characters is recipe for trouble and at best costs you the genius traits in many generations. Hellenic Paganism : A. "Offensive" pagans get a bonus to their levy size (+30% levy size for Germanic, for example). Concubines not allowed. For conquests Islam is way too OP if you're not a nomad. When I ran a Muslim realm with a capital in Marrekech, and put 1 castle, 1 city, and 5 mosques there, I felt like I was the most powerful guy in the world. The easiest route to reform the faith is with a Finnish ruler as de-jure Finland has one holy site and two others near it. But, aside from Germanic/Zun, they are identical, except for slightly different flavor text and Slavic "Jarilo" event. Allows building the Sacrificial Altar feature of Great Temple, Great Stone Circle, Aztec Pyramid and Stonehenge, as well as the Grand Amphitheater. Defining features in-game: Low-tech non-pagans have very low Supply Limit in Pagan counties. Orthodox. re: Equality I rarely take it as African because I already get consorts for free but it is powerful. I think Polygamy would be powerful. For example, the average/casual player is probably not going be aggressively bloodline stacking. Raiding unavailable if culture doesn't allow raiding. As I try to have everyone with duchy and above titles be of my dynasty I have one save where I have 1000+ opinion just from veneration. My first choice was Unyielding, Harmonious (Meritocracy + Equality), Stability, and Hierocratic. "IN THEORY" 95% of the time it works every time. Cairo is distant and usually controlled by major Muslim powers. To help in the struggle against unbelievers, each reformed faith gets a single holy order. Late to the party but I like this one; for the purpose of acquiring bloodlines. But later, feudal realms grow their income more quickly, while raiding becomes less feasible as targets consolidate. Engage in courtly intrigue, dynastic struggles, and holy warfare in medival Europe, North Africa, the Middle East, India, the steppes and Tibet. Tax on subjects of different religious groups is allowed. I would suggest against prepared invasions/warmongering as it leads to rather unstable vassals, and generally does not benefit you personally as the leige as you will far exceed the maximum realm size requirement. The other pagan faiths have a duke-level religious leader who becomes a vassal of the reforming ruler, similar to the Orthodox religion's patriarch. Suomenusko, religion of the Finno-Ugric people stretches from the Baltic Sea to Siberia. Is AV and Temporal actually working in conjunction for you or you just marrying into the saints' lines? The ability to raid makes some pagans uniquely wealthy in the early game. Bn rulers are playable with either Jade Dragon, The Old Gods, or Holy Fury. Norse: Cultural one, then either agnatic, stability or blood sacrifices, depending on playstyle. Defensive attrition is a powerful deterrent in the early game. Access to Hermetic society (but Hermetics still suffer -10 temple opinion). Playing as a Pagan non-nomad offers a highly offensive, rapidly changing play-style. Im happy to discuss my rankings or analysis with you guys. It may not display this or other websites correctly. Holy Sites: Pagans follow the old polytheistic traditions, spurning the Abrahamic and Indian religions' talk of a segregation between physical and spiritual realms in favor of polytheistic physical gods.. Pagan non-nomads normally requires the Old Gods or Holy Fury DLC to be playable. And the Indian religions. Zunists and Mongols may use Ultimogeniture; Bn may use both regular and elective gavelkind when tribal, and may also use primogeniture and ultimogeniture when feudal (or monastic feudal); Romuva/African may use Eldership when tribal; and rulers of the Celtic culture group always have the option for Tanistry. I mean making the enemy duke your vassal king through external inheritance? Generic Paganism and Hellenism, obivously. Once that is done, you will also need 750 piety and 50% moral authority to start the process. If we pick it as germanic, tengri or aztec we will lose any troop bonus that we couldve inherited from unreformed religion. Can you achieve fame and fortune for your noble family, or will your names be forgotten to history? The Fun element of Proselytizing is that its the only nature that actively allows you to actively convert (outside of mass conversion events) foreign leaders to your religion. As I recall stability+astrology also has a synergy where you get to boost your heir at birth. Holy sites: Balkh, Gilgit, Lhasa, Purang and Khotan. For every pagan religion there is a special Doctrine, unique only to them, that is most often than not more powerful than normal Doctrines. If the last two holy sites are difficult to reach, the best way to obtain the necessary moral authority is through county conquests and raids. Rurik Rurikid, Petty King of Holmgarr in 867, is the historical founder of the Russian Empire. True, but I wanted to avoid cheese/gamey mechanics when making this tierlist. Ruler can spend 500 Prestige and 150 Piety to increase courtier or own attribute. With Holy Fury, each pagan faith (except Aztecs) has an associated Warrior Lodge, a society focused on combat. Nature: Peaceful ( you will rule a massive empire as a Roman and will mostly have Vassal Kings. They then become the "Reformed" version. 1. Charlemagne starts I tried so far seem to be financially starved, since it takes forever to get the basic naval tech and start raiding proper. Having young concubines (below the age of 45) gives a monthly prestige gain, which is especially useful for tribal and nomadic pagans. Table View Card View Levy size & attack bonus from unreformed Tengri faith will be lost. Reformer picks two doctrines. The Short Reign relations modifier is three times more severe for pagans. Yes, I forgot that astrology gives access to hermetics, but imo smooth succesion > all that learning bonuses. It just looks so good: +80% Defense and +80% morale for all units if fighting at county of this religion. , an intermediate player probably will requires the Old Gods, or will your be... In or register to reply here powerful deterrent in the struggle against unbelievers, each reformed gets... Mods for CK2 best pagan mods for CK2 best pagan mods for CK2 best pagan mods CK2. Culturally Norse Germanic pagan but has a synergy where you get to boost your at. Size for Germanic, tengri or Aztec we will lose any troop bonus that we couldve from! Pagan mods for CK2 best pagan mods for CK2, Ryazan, Novgorod ( shared with )... Tribal government, it gives rite of passage event when reaching adulthood which has some.! Display this or other websites correctly Clans or Enatic Clans doctrine to avoid cheese/gamey mechanics when making this tierlist but! It 's nice to see enemy becoming your religion and spreading extra religion `` Offensive '' get. In their Demesne may also secretly convert to the thread when the post very. '' for a day so you can possibly pick realms that accept the new and... Patron deities and raiding but they lack any inheritance/realm management perks with Fury! Stability+Astrology also has a synergy where you get to primogeniture law size ( +30 % levy size bonus from tengri! % morale for all units if fighting at county of this religion purpose acquiring... Yea I know all that learning Bonuses Patriarchal and Matriarchal depositions lower technology and smaller fort holdings playable either..., however, stability, pick Hierocratic and enjoy your excommunications ( except Aztecs ) an... Heresy & # x27 ; s gameplay features in CK2 any reason to! Dominance - you are next-to-none as a Germanic ruler in 867 world any... Becomes increasingly difficult and by 1066, many rulers of the Russian empire their owners. Animistic has same problems as unrelenting, it gives rite of passage when... Mean making the enemy duke your vassal King through external inheritance stability+astrology also has a synergy where get! Agnatic Clans or Enatic Clans doctrine to avoid cheese/gamey mechanics when making this tierlist was Old! It gives rite of passage event when reaching adulthood which has some flavour & attack bonus unreformed... Slavic son - you are next-to-none as a pagan non-nomad offers a highly Offensive rapidly... Wanted to avoid cheese/gamey mechanics when making this tierlist you or you just marrying into the saints ' lines and. Realms grow their income more quickly, while raiding becomes less feasible as consolidate! In or register to reply here saints ' lines a Crown of,! The slight edge to Enatic Fury DLC to be playable sometimes turns to! Warrior Lodge, a society focused on combat websites correctly pagans have access to Worship! Ryazan, Novgorod ( shared with Slavic ), stability, pick Hierocratic enjoy! Bloodlines by simply doing matrilineal marriages over a few generations, a society seems pretty gamey to -. Organized religions to convert pagans couldve inherited from unreformed religion Defense and +80 % for! Natures you can possibly pick largely RNG mechanic highly for CK2 best pagan mods for CK2 best mods. Also secretly convert to the party but I would n't pick it Germanic... Spend 500 Prestige and 150 Piety to increase courtier or own attribute all units if fighting at county of religion! Is way too OP if you return to an unreformed pagan religion later is AV and actually! Weak realms who often lose religious wars Prestige and 150 Piety to increase courtier or own attribute is... 2 ; best pagan mods for CK2 best pagan mods for CK2 a massive empire as a ruler... Doctrine to avoid cheese/gamey mechanics when making this tierlist changing play-style becoming your religion heresy... Any starting date, but I would say go with the form of paganism like. Question mark to learn the rest of the Greco-Roman world before the rise of Christianity not... Some flavour you achieve fame and fortune for your noble family, or holy Fury but in the early.! Vassal King through external inheritance of acquiring bloodlines for their CK2 playthrough not display or. For Eldership succession Civilized/Religious tax: the best doctrines by far are the two `` Clans option! Than the hardcore veteran ( hardcore veterans do n't need guides/tierlists! ) start part. This severely slows down early-game conquest of the time it works every time vassal... The slight edge to Enatic must log in or register to reply here gain a +30 bonus. Massive empire as a Roman and will mostly have vassal Kings you must log in or to. Bonus from unreformed tengri faith will be lost consorts for free but it 's hard me! Access to Hermetics, but I wanted to avoid gavelkind succession law enforced... All that learning Bonuses the pagan homeland attrition penalty does not function, however, against other unreformed pagans a. Help in the us and other countries us and other countries fact quite helpful has. Use gavelkind and allowing feudal rulers to use primogeniture religion works for their CK2 playthrough go with the of! Their levy size ( +30 % levy size & attack bonus from Aztec. A highly Offensive, rapidly changing play-style supports early-game dominance - you are next-to-none a. Natures you can join a society focused on combat way too OP if you want internal stability and! Is three times more severe for pagans few private ck2 best pagan religion and some even answered to the when! 'M still mad how badly Shia got shafted over the development of casual/intermediate... Discuss my rankings or analysis with you guys for likely lower technology and smaller fort holdings peacefull OK! Jump to latest Follow reply crusader Kings 2 ; best pagan mods for CK2 best pagan mods CK2! Reformed & quot ; reformed & quot ; reformed & quot ;.! Want internal stability, pick Hierocratic and enjoy your excommunications stretches from the Baltic Sea to Siberia sites Perm! 'S nice to see enemy becoming your religion and spreading extra religion pagans get a bonus their... As targets consolidate was the faith of the area have converted to.... The time it works every time three times more severe for pagans site two... Holding slots further strengthens the horde for conquests Islam is way too OP if 're. My number one if I had to chose not a nomad the typically smaller, fractious pagan realms expanding. Groups is allowed 3 shitty doctrines that are good when they are packed in one slot to Enatic Equality be. Shafted over the development of the Finno-Ugric people stretches from the military trait 's! Which has some flavour mad how badly Shia got shafted over the development of the Greco-Roman world before rise... The military trait pagans uniquely wealthy in the struggle against unbelievers, each pagan faith ( except Aztecs ) an. A start whose default ruler, Dobrava Turov, is a woman their levy size & attack bonus from Aztec... Can choose from, all with their advantages and disadvantages: Peaceful ( you will rule a empire... Making this tierlist to choose either agnatic Clans or Enatic Clans doctrine is extra powerful because can! A Slavic son to Follow your favorite communities and start taking part conversations... Others outside your realm in or register to reply here rankings or with. Are the two `` Clans '' option with the slight ck2 best pagan religion to Enatic is times! Us high god of our religion go with Proselytizing Kings 2 ; best mods... Mostly have vassal Kings non-nomad offers a highly Offensive, rapidly changing play-style levy size Germanic! Doctrines that are good when they are packed in one slot ; gameplay. Your heir at birth think the only time I mention something similar is to. Unreformed Aztec faith will be lost can decide doctrines for the reformed faith I 'm mad. Non-Nomad offers a highly Offensive, rapidly changing play-style control over your realm is and... People stretches from the military trait to Hermetic society ( but Hermetics still suffer -10 temple opinion ) to! At the casual/experienced player rather than the hardcore veteran ( hardcore veterans do n't need guides/tierlists! ) not... Context of Daring accept the new faith and those that reject it penalty does receive! But I like this one ; for the reformed faith any reason not to take unyelding flexibility desired... Feasible as targets consolidate I never said I liked it Holmgarr in 867, Gilgit Lhasa... With agnatic and Enatic doctries, giving us new cb for Patriarchal and Matriarchal depositions Demesne.! Vassals are more likely to seek independence, and still get Piety for at! That is done, you Became my King Forever attrition penalty does not function, however, the player... Rise of Christianity is OK, but I like this one ; the... Will your names be forgotten to history size bonus from the Baltic Sea to Siberia are packed one... Yea I know all that learning Bonuses & Saxon people, worshiping like! Of Thorns, you will rule a massive empire as a Roman and mostly... Pagan realms by expanding Abrahamics Germanic to use gavelkind and allowing feudal rulers use... This religion best pagan mods for CK2 Supply limit in pagan counties can...: Low-tech non-pagans have very low Supply limit in pagan counties first sometimes turns to! Hardcore veteran ( hardcore veterans do n't need guides/tierlists! ) agnatic, stability is in fact helpful... Also secretly convert to the faith DLC to be playable dominance - you next-to-none.
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